For any and all Lions fans out here, I wanted to get a forum for them rolling. Sorry if there's already one, didn't see it.

Unfortunately, I moved from Michigan to Colorado a few months ago, and therefore I won't be able to see much of my Lions this year. So I was especially attentive to the Lions first preseason game against the Broncos (Thank you God). Some players who really made an impact on me were Bill Swancutt, Josh McCown, and Ernie Sims. I know it's still pre-season, and the games really don't matter so much. But individually, I really think these three players had great games. I hope to see more of them this year, but I'm sure that'll have to be on NFL Network. Any thoughts?

How is the QB competition fairing? Will it become a 1st or 2nd round draft pick next year?

To be honest, I like Jon Kitna. I think he's got 3-4 years of starting NFL Football left in him. Behind him, you got Josh McCown who has looked good so far. They also got the kid that they drafted from UMaine or Uconn, can't remember, but Dan Orlovsky. Orlovsky has a great arm, as far as accuracy and especially deep arm strength. His problem at this point in his career is Pocket awareness and decision making. Some would say that Joey Harrington suffered (or suffers) from the same thing. Either way, I really don't see them looking QB early in the draft. As long as contracts are workable with Kitna.

Kitna for a few years, then draft someone good is what I wanna do. Im not sold on Orlovsky, McCown or any of the others quite honestly.

Orvlosky went to Uconn, and he's a good ballplayer.

Davis, I'm really not "sold" on either QB's at this point either. But both have damn good mentors right now (both in Martz and Kitna), and both have pro arms. I think either or could develop into a fine starting NFL QB. I think the Lions will be hesitent to draft QB anywhere above round 4, until they really get the scoop on these two guys.

Also, I think if healthy, the Lions could have the best new LB corps in the NFL. Moving Teddy to MLB is something I've said they need to do since day 1. Adding Ernie Sims and a healthy Boss Bailey means that they could be one of the most disruptive LB teams in the NFL. I really do believe that they can live up to that potential, if all 3 stay healthy.

Actually, the defensive unit altogether is looking a lot better than last year. They will get the quick and aggressive DT Shawn Cody to start this year, along with Cory Redding and returning Pro Bowl Alternate James Hall. Then of course, you got Shaun Rogers who is 100% healthy. The only question really is in the secondary. But they've done a great job of improving their safety situation. Adding Danny Bullocks and Idrees Bashir both likely to start. Dre Bly is a pro bowler, if he can get along with the new coaching unit. The biggest question is Fernando Bryant. I think by now the Lions understand that he alone will never survive an entire season. He's too skinny, and just gets beat up by bigger receivers.

Right now, the NFC North division is COMPLETELY up in the air. There are 3 brand new Head Coaches (meaning no prior head-coaching exp), and the only team that has proven anything is Chicago. I have to think that the Bears are the favorite for the division this year, but with so much changing in the NFC North, I think the Lions hold a good chance to explode onto the scene this year.

I play in a fantasy football league with individual defensive players. I drafted Ernie Sims (as my third LB behind Vilma and Tatupu). Hope he has a good rookie year.

As for QB... I too like Kitna. He has the veteran leadership along with a good track record at Cincinnati. I could see him being the starter for at least the next couple years and then Orlovsky could step in. I'm not sold on McCown as anything but a backup in the NFL. Orlovsky has yet to sour me, although he hasn't had much time to do so.

So far, the Lions are awful. They got a moral victory in week 1 shutting down the high powered Seattle offense, but Roy Williams has popped off about how good they are, yet they only have 12 points on the season!

I like Kitna, but dont know if he is suited for this style of offense. R Williams is great, but his ridiculous comments are just bringing negativity to an already negative team.

The defense is performing extremely well and keeping them in games. Ernie Sims, could win DROY. The secondary is not playing up to par.

If Martz can fix this offense, and Marinelli can get Williams to shut up, they could start to win some games, but I dont see them winning many.

Do you think home-town hero Drew Stanton is a good fit for the offense ?

Not necessarily. He dosent have elite arm strength and his deep ball I consider to be a weakness. We need more of a downhill passer with a bigger arm. I see Stanton as more of a WCO guy, like his clone Alex Smith. Brady Quinn or Brian Brohm are better fits in Detroit IMO.

I don't think the Lions will warrant a pick high enough for Quinn or Brohm maybe a guy like Jordan Palmer or John Beck in later rounds could be good.

Oh I dont see the Lions winning much so if Brohm comes out, the Lions could be in the winning. If Troy Smith continues to play out of his mind, some team might fall in love in the top 10, but I doubt that.

Davis, I really don't mind Roy Williams' antics. His words were not well-advised, but it was a division game. I think he's a good leader for the ball club. The Media has made him out to be some sorta loud mouth, but his history would indicate differently. I think he's just trying to motivate his team mates to play up to their extraordinary potential.

The defense has looked good so far this year, and that will win them a few games. They are still trying to get the offensive mesh going, so to speak, but if you look at Kitna's numbers, he's doing alright. Just haven't been able to sniff out the endzone yet. As far as the future, I think I'll give that a bit longer before I decide. Who knows, 2-3 more games into the season Kitna could find his rhythm and start hitting his receivers. Mike Furrey, in particular, has been impressive.

Overall, I am not yet ready to write off the entire season, though, I do think that the Bears will have an easy time winning the division. If Rex continues on the way he has, they are going to be nearly unstoppable. Might even harbor legitimate Super Bowl talk. Although, I see Atlanta, Washington, Philly, NYG, and possibly even New Orleans giving them some stiff competition. The NFC is certainly stepping up to the recent claims of being the "weaker" conference.

I'm getting off the point though. I think the Lions are good enough to find a .500 finish this year. Not much better, but not much worse. However, the future is still looking foggy, because Martz will probably pursue a Head Coaching position after this season, and that should definitely throw things into chaos in Detroit once again. So my prediction is that the Lions we see this year, will probably be the best Lions we see for a few years. Coaching continuity is really so important. Figure maybe the Lions will get that sooner or later.

I think Williams is a winner too, and that he's getting tired of losing. I like him a lot as a player. You are probably correct about his motive for making such a statement. Still, it was ill advised. He's still young, so if he's still a Lion when they start winning, maybe he'll be there to lend advice before another youngster makes the same mistake.

Yep, for the record, Roy went 7 catches for 138 yards and a TD yesterday. He's a definite leader on this club. 0-3 is not a good start for any team, but year after year, the Lions have high hopes and they always seem to come crashing down. If I were Roy, I'd be sick of it too. Whatever it takes to light a fire under some Lion-asses, is what is necessary IMO.

I want H.B. Blades

The newest chatter around the Detroit Lions front office is that Matt Millen is planning on throwing a 3 year, 15-million dollar contract at Mike Martz. This would make him the first offensive coordinator in NFL history to be salaried at a higher dollar amount than the Head coach.

He's 1000% worth every penny. Do it. Lock him up for 3 years, then promote him to Head coach if possible. Martz is the kind of guy that every single player on the offense can "buy in" to. People have faith in him. And his scheme is coming together perfectly in Detroit. If they can lock him into a contract at the end of this season, they will be Superbowl Contenders within 3 years. I guarantee this.

No no. You don't want Mike Martz as your head coach. I think he can be the BEST O-coordinator in the entire league, and could very well help turn the Lions into contenders- but not as a head coach. He was dreadful in St. Louis. Let him handle all the X's and O's on offense, but once he gets too much power, Martz will hurt the team.

About these Lions- Roy Williams is on my fantasy team and I love him. He can say whatever he wants becuase he is amazing. Keep giving him the ball. Actually, throw it to him on EVERY SINGLE PLAY, and NEVER give it to Kevin Jones (the first place team owns Jones).

It's very early, but what do you guys see as your top needs for the draft? Personally, about the QB situation- I've seen Jon Kitna lead a Seahawks team into the playoffs. I know Jon Kitna can look like a very good QB, but if the chance to draft a Brady Quinn presents itself, this team would have to pull the trigger... I don't think they'll be picking that high though because I think they'll win some games here in the second half... but I disagree with your assessment that QB isn't much of a need because of Kitna- don't let him fool you- this inconsistent guy will 7-9, 9-7 you to death...

And one more question:

What are they going to do about Mike Williams and Charles Rogers. Cut them? Keep one, drop the other? Trade them? What can they get? I'd take a chance on Mike Williams in a second...

Rogers has been cut and Mike Williams is essentially on the practice squad. Mike Furrey has really stepped up as the Lions number 2 receiver. They are disappointed with Mike Williams thus far, but havent decided to get rid of him yet.

A couple thoughts:

For the draft. I don't care what anyone says about Kitna, HE CAN BE A GREAT QB AND HE HAS PROVEN IT BEFORE. QUINN IS NOT AN UPGRADE. Joe Thomas needs to be the priority pick for the Lions. This was evident by the line giving up the most sacks this season, and a non-existent running game no matter who was in the backfield. Of course, I think best case scenario would be to trade down to around the 10-15 area, grab Justin Blalock, and a 2nd round pick along with maybe a 4th.

Overall this year...horrible. Roy Williams was the only bright spot, and even he took some games off. The O-Line was the worst I've seen in a long time, which confuses me considering Backus is ALLEGEDLY good. Woody obviously wasn't around, I think he can be a great player, but he's been very injury prone. Dominic Raiola, as always, is the best player on the line, IMO, and needs to be kept in Detroit for his whole career.

D-Line I think now also needs to be a priority. Shaun Rogers, while capable, is obviously having weight/health/drug issues. James Hall didn't nearly duplicate his season from last year, Kalimba Edwards still underachieving and making way too much money...

Fernando Bryant...hurt as always. Dre' Bly was decent again. I really like Bullocks and Kenoy Kennedy, although I'd love to see a LaRon Landry in the backfield...

The team shows promise...The offense definitely has a chance to be one of the best in the league if there's a capable O-Line. Kitna is good. I'm still under the belief that Furrey would be better as a slot man, and we need a bigger-stronger guy as the #2, but eh. It would be nice to see BMW finally get his sh*t together and become our #2, with Furrey at #3, but I digress.

The defense...I don't know what to think. There's talent all over the field, but it doesn't gel. Hall is good, Rogers is good, Bly is good, Bryant when healthy is kind of good...Sims/Lehman/Bailey has the potential to be the best linebacking corps in the league IMO, Kennedy has always been good, Bullocks has shown great potential this year. It kind of reminds me of the Detroit Tigers. The Tigers have had talent the last 5 years, but it never came together. This year it clicked all at the same time and look what happened.

Not often that you hear someone say "I wish the Lions were as good as the Tigers..." but here we are.

The one question I have is why is Matt Millen staying? this guy needs to be fired, as long as he is in Detriot I don't see this team doing well, the GM is a critical position on a team and if the GM keeps failing at picking coachs and keeps having bad drafts than the team won't be good

Lookin like the Lions might be heading in the direction of trading down from the #2 spot they picked up Bell and have Jones so AP aint really likely Also they signed RT George Foster so Thomas is lookin less likely So r they gonna trade down and how far Do they trade with Arizona and pick up a DE or farther down

If they stay, I believe the pick will be Gaines Adams. They really like him and with his solid workout, he could warrant a high pick. Thomas still could be a possibility, so could Quinn or Russell. But if they trade down, they will pick up an end, or maybe even corner, but if they stay pat, like I think they will, they will take Gaines Adams.

I actually think Millen has done alright this offseason. With the additions of Tatum Bell, George Foster, TJ Duckett, Shaun McDonald, and Dewayne White we are on the right track. Because we have Bell/Duckett, we don't need Adrian Peterson, and with the addition of Foster, Thomas is not necessary either. Dewayne White is a good signing, so we don't really need Gaines Adams. So who do draft? I say Quinn, but we should trade down. Rumor is we are trying to work something out with the Cardinals: 2nd pick for 5th pick plus a player and/or a pick. That is a good deal, as Quinn will be available at 5. Kitna can mentor him for about 1/2 year to 1 year, as like he did with Carson Palmer.
Here's a look at our potential roster:
Offense:
QB-Jon Kitna/Brady Quinn
RB-Tatum Bell/TJ Duckett/Kevin Jones
FB-???, as we lost Schlesinger to the 'Phins
WR1-Roy Williams/Mike Williams
WR2-Mike Furrey/Shaun McDonald
TE-Dan Campbell/Casey Fitzsimmons
LT-Jeff Backus
LG-Frank Davis
C-Dominic Raijola
RG-Blaine Saipaia
RT-George Foster
Defense:
DE-Jared DeVries/Kalimba Edwards
DT-Cory Redding/Shaun Cody
DT-Shaun Rogers/Cleveland Pinkney
DE-Dewayne White/Bill Swancutt III
OLB-Boss Bailey/Alex Lewis
MLB-Paris Lenon/Teddy Lehman
OLB-Ernie Sims/Anthony Cannon
CB-Fernando Bryant/Keith Smith
SS-Kenoy Kennedy
FS-Daniel Bullocks
CB-Travis Fisher/Stanley Wilson
Special Teams:
K-Jason Hanson
P-Nick Narris
H-Nick Harris
PR/KR-Eddie Drummond

I think you have to make the Brady Quinn pick. Passing on Leinart last year was a mistake. The Dewayne White signing means no Gaines Adams, IMO. But, we'll see. Anything can happen.

The Lions can trade down and get pretty much anyone they want. They are sitting at the best spot in the first round right now. This draft can be like their 04 draft where they really solidified the offense with Roy Williams and Kevin Jones in the first.

I think they trade down, because someone wants Thomas, and they pick up either a QB, or DE.

I agree. They could fill some holes if they trade down. I think someone will want to move up to get Calvin Johnson. That's assuming that Russell goes first.

Personally, I have a slightly different view on the top few spots. The Denver Post published an article today stating that the Lions had contacted them about trading down to the 21st overall spot. Apparently negotiations had broken down due to the fact that the Lions were looking for 4 picks in exchange for their coveted #2 overall position.

Personally, I don't feel the Lions have any need to select a QB in the first round. They got a career year out of Jon Kitna last season, and I expect his development to continue. I do, however, expect them to look at that option in the second or third round, and a guy like Trent Edwards would fit the Martz offense about perfectly. If they do trade out of the #2, Quinn isn't likely to be around long. Whoever moves up will be looking for CJ or possibly Brady Quinn himself. And remember, Quinn is a Charlie Weiss product. There is no guarantee that Romeo Crennel won't want him @ #3 overall.

As far as the Lions are concerned, I would still like to see them pick within the top 12 and have a chance at Levi Jones. Starting Jones at LT, moving Backus to RT, and asking Foster to go inside to LG would make for a very solid offensive line, along side Dominic Raiola and Rick DeMulling (who is finally healthy).

If they can lock up a couple of second or third rounders, they'll have plenty of room to add a contributing DE and a solid backup QB later on.

Lions sign 2 Offensive Guards, Edwin Muliatalo and Zach Pillar. Apparently they don't want to draft O-line this year. :s

With the addition of Mulitalo and Piller, it doesn't look like we will draft
o-line on day one.
With that said, here's what I say we should do:

Round 1: Gaines Adams, DE/Clemson (After trade w/ Cardinals)
Round 2: Brandon Merriweather, S/Miami
Round 3: Trent Edwards, QB/Stanford
Round 4: Justin Durant, MLB/Hampton
Round 5: LeRon McClain, FB/Arkansas
Round 6: ???
Round 7: ???
Round 7 Compensation: ???

Boy, I really like the idea of getting a technically sound guy like Trent Edwards as late as the 3rd round. And a trade back to snag a pure pass-rusher like Gaines Adams would suit me. But Brandon Merriweather is a bad pick. Call it personal opinion, but the kid is the next Pac Man Jones imo. I wouldn't want a player like him on the team, even if he is a pro bowl caliber player. I also wouldn't complain about Justin Durant, but for those three picks that you couldn't foresee, gosh, I don't know maybe a few fresh faces on the Offensive Line? Who cares if we got some big time guys in Trade and FA, you can never have too much depth along the O-line.

Okay, time to get down to brass tacks. ADAVIS! I'm callin you out! Let's rap, man, tell me what you see goin down for the Lions on the 28th and (more importantly) the 29th.

First round, gosh it's just so difficult to predict this one. Where we currently sit @ #2, the options are literally endless. Do we stay? Do we trade down? What is our asking price if we trade down? If we set our hearts on moving down, and don't get a deal done, who do we take at #2? So here's how I see it.

If Russell is off the board first, we work frantically with Tampa Bay or Washington to move down. Washington recently invited JaMarcus Russell in for a visit, and they're said to have SOME interest in a QB. Whether this is a smokescreen or not, is yet to be seen. If a trade down can't be reached, I say the Lions go out on that whim and Select Calvin Johnson. He's the kind of guy who can really complete this Mike Martz offense. He will be the Isaac Bruce to Roy Williams' impression of Torry Holt. With Mike Furrey playing a younger Az-zahir Hakim. A new greatest show on Turf? Maaaybe.

Round two I think defense right away. I don't think there's another option to go to here. And if they do select offense in the first round, who's to say they can't go after one of those Stud UofM LB's? I know, I know...Woodley is a 3-4 OLB all the way. But he played 3 seasons at UofM with his hand in the dirt. I'd venture to say he's gonna be as good of a pass-rusher as Gaines Adams.

Then there's the idea of grabbing up a CB in the second round. Certainly Marcus McCauley and Aaron Ross will be available at that slot. The question is, do we really want to entrust our starting CB position to Travis Fischer? I don't...

Adavis, get in this man, let's rap.

New Day One Mock:
Round 1, Pick 4 (After trade w/ Bucs): Gaines Adams, DE/Clemson
Round 2, Pick 2: Eric Weddle, S/Utah
Round 3, Pick 2: Trent Edwards, QB/Stanford
Round 3, Pick 4 (After trade w/ Bucs): Justin Durant

I agree Merriweather is a bad pick. I just found out about his legal troubles.

Man, I'm really hoping against Eric Weddle. I don't care much for him. If I had it my way, it'd look like this:

#4 (after trade down): Brady Quinn
Round 2: David Harris
Round 3: Quinten Moses
Round 4: Daymeion Hughes

Being that you have Quinn at 4, care to share your top 3?

Sure, why not.

The way I see it, JaMarcus Russell goes #1 still. Tampa trades up to #2 and takes Calvin Johnson. Then I see the Browns taking Adrian Pederson at #3. The Lions get Quinn at #4, Cards take Joe Thomas at 5, and the Skins take 19 year old Amobi Okoye at #6.

Why don't you think Cleveland will take Quinn?

Latest out of Detroit is that they'll likely take Calvin Johnson at #2 if they can't trade down. I have to believe they would trade him like Eli Manning was traded a few years ago...

I doubt it, if they can't make a deal happen, I could easily see Calvin Johnson playing in this offense next year. There's no question that the Lions have him just as valuable as the other 31 teams in the NFL. But if they can get greater value in exchange with draft picks, they'll move down. Problem is, that #2 position is of so high value, if anyone below 10 wanted it they'd have to sell the barn.

God damn it...sometimes I'm so good it just hurts. Anyways, I'll get back to my gloating later...

Any thoughts from you Mute Lions fans about their draft? Personally I think they had an A- year. Getting the biggest playmaker in the draft in Calvin Johnson and their likely future Starting QB Drew Stanton in round 2.

As far as their next two picks are concerned, I was tenative at first. But once I learned a bit more about each of the players (Alama-Francis and Alexander), I'm content with the selections. A-F is a raw pass-rusher with crazy physical strength (6'5" 280lbs...a chiseled Greek GOD), and Gerald Alexander is a zone/cover2 safety who posterized a few wide receivers in college. Then you got A.J. Davis at Cornerback, an obvious need since the loss of Dre Bly and the incompetency of Fernando Bryant.

They also selected Mr. Irrelevent, but who really gives 2 craps and a handful of peanuts about him?

Just threw up in my mouth.

Actually, other than Johnson, if I were a Lion's fan I'd be celebrating the pick of Davis. Doesn't have prototype height/weight, but this guy just does not get beat deep. At the very least, a real good nickel back IMO.

Being a Texas Longhorn, i have in recent years become a Lions fans secondary to their drafting of a few Longhorns. What do you guys think of the O with Roy Williams on one side and Calvin Johnson on the other and Furry in the slot. the OL just needs to give the QB 3-4 seconds. it should help the running game also, since both Williams and Johnson are great blockers. in 2-3 yrs this should be the best O in the league, they just need 2-4 more pieces on the O side. 2 more OL, a mature QB, and maybe another RB.
what do you guys think that get to watch lion games?

They added Tatum Bell and TJ Ducket to a roster that has Kevin Jones, Shawn Bryson, and Brian Calhoun. There's plenty of depth at RB right now. Also, they managed to add Edwin Mulitalo (a pro bowler) and Zach Pillar to the interior of the offensive line, and the 26-year old Right Tackle George Foster. Meanwhile, Damien Woody has lost about 45lbs. this offseason, and will be moving to the LG position so that Mulitalo can start on the right. I expect them to be a better offense than they have been in quite a while. I still think that they need to re-evaluate the situation at RB (Cutting 2-3 guys in favor of a true starting talent), but I'm curious to see how good Tatum Bell (Oklahoma State WOOOO-HOOOO) is.

Kynmike, say what you want, but if Stanton gets 2-3 years under current offensive Coordinator Mike Martz, look out. And time will tell on it. Many think that he's a bust, but Drew Stanton is an athletic player with the heart of a Lion (no pun intended). If he gets his mechanics down, and learns the very extensive playbook, he's going to be a good QB in this league.

Whahaha, yeah, you were the guy saying that Curt Anes was going to take them to the Superbowl, right?

The Detroit Lions Projected Depth Chart, including Position Battles:

OFFENSE:

QB: Jon Kitna --> Dan Orlovsky --> Drew Stanton®
RB: Kevin Jones --> Tatum Bell --> S. Bryson --> TJ Duckett --> B. Calhoun
FB: Paul Jones
WR1: Roy Williams --> Calvin Johnson --> Mike Furrey --> Shaun MacDonald
WR2: Calvin Johnson® --> Mike Furrey --> Marcus Robinson
WR3: Mike Furrey --> Shaun MacDonald --> M. Robinson --> E. Drummond
TE: Dan Campbell --> Casey Fitzsimmons --> G. Cooper ®
LT: Jeff Backus --> Jon Scott --> Rex Tucker
LG: Stephen Peterman --> Damien Woody --> Manuel Ramirez
RG: Edwin Mulitalo --> Zach Pillar --> Ben Noll
C: Dominic Raiola --> Dave Pearson --> Frank Davis

DEFENSE:
LE: Dewayne White --> Bill Swancutt --> Jared DeVries --> C. Harriot
RE: Corey Redding --> Kalimba Edwards --> I. Alama-Francis
DT: Shaun Rogers --> Langston Moore --> Cleveland Pinkney
UT: Shaun Cody --> Marcus Parker --> Jon Bradley
SLB: Boss Bailey --> Alex Lewis --> Donte Curry
MLB: Paris Lenon --> Teddy Lehman --> Johnny Baldwin
WLB: Ernie Sims --> Alex Lewis --> Anthony Cannon
CB: Fernando Bryant --> AJ Davis --> Keith Smith
CB: Travis Fischer --> Stanley Wilson --> Ramzee Robinson
FS: Daniel Bullocks --> Idrees Bashir
SS: Kenoy Kennedy --> Gerald Alexander

ST:

K: Jason Hanson --> Kenny Byrd
P: Nick Harris
KR/PR: Eddie Drummond

Position Battles:

QB2: Orlovsky --> Stanton
RB: Kevin Jones <-- Tatum Bell
WR2: Calvin Johnson <-- Mike Furrey
G: Stephen Peterman --> Damien Woody
DE: Kalimba Edwards --> Corey Redding
DT: Corey Redding --> Shaun Cody
MLB: Paris Lennon --> Teddy Lehman <-- Johnny Baldwin
CB: Travis Fischer <-- A.J. Davis
S: Dan Bullocks --> Idrees Bashir

That's really what I love to see. There's a lot of competition going on right now. It'll be good for the team.

I don't see ROT listed, and I was wondering if you don't think Scott might wrestle the job away from Foster this year, especially considering the financial obligation the Lions made to Backus?

George Foster has been lining up as the Starting Right Tackle in minicamps thus far. He's a former 1st round pick, and a guy who has started his last 45 games (48 consecutive games played). He's a shoe-in for the job. Jon Scott was well outmatched last season, and still has a lot of growing to do in the NFL. I think he'll be the eventual successor to Jeff Backus, but with the additions of 3 new offensive guards (Mulitalo, Pillar, Ramirez), it's not likely that he'll see the field if everyone is healthy.